Darlene Vinson Curran & Tim Curran Oral History
Parkrose Community Archive: So, it’s February 18, 2024. We’re in the Argay [Terrace] neighborhood of Parkrose in Portland, Oregon, in the home of Darlene and Tim. Thank you both for being here. Could each of you state your full name, just to start?
Darlene Vinson Curran: Darlene Vinson Curran.
PCA: Perfect.
Tim Curran: Tim Curran.
PCA: Perfect! I’m thinking we’ll start with Darlene, just because you were the first to arrive in Parkrose. So, could you begin by just kind of discussing where you’re originally from, when you were born, and kind of your arrival to Parkrose?
DVC: I was born in 1951 in Portland, Oregon. I grew up in what is the David Douglas School District, so just a few miles from here. And that’s—my early memories are all there, around 127th [Avenue] and Stark [Street]. And we moved to Parkrose after I completed eighth grade at Menlo Park Elementary. My parents bought their first home in Parkrose, up in what’s the Parkrose Heights neighborhood, in 1965.
PCA: Nice. I guess kind of to start, too, what was your family like growing up, and what was the decision to move to Parkrose?
DVC: I have two younger sisters. Most of our relatives—mostly my mom’s side, my dad had a very small family—but nearly everybody was out in Fairview, Troutdale area. And my parents moved to Fairview during the war, so they had connections in Fairview and Wood Village, you know—friends from, say, age 13 or so that they grew up with. So we tended to head that way for socializing and so forth. The impetus for moving for Parkrose really was my parents had always wanted to own their own home. And I remember summers, driving around with my mom, looking at all these real estate listings until, eventually, they found the one they wanted.
PCA: Yeah. I’m curious because my parents are in the Parkrose Heights area—that’s where my house is, growing up. So I’m kind of curious what the house looked like, and also what the neighborhood was like when you first got there.
DVC: Um—kids everywhere. Much more so than the neighborhood we had lived in before. And there was a commercial building right on the corner opposite our house that, before we got there, had been a small grocery store, but was a bridge club when we moved there. So certain nights and on weekends there would be people coming to the bridge club, and there were kids everywhere, and all ages. And some big families—so each myself and my sisters would have someone in their class that was from that family.
PCA: Yeah, that’s cool. I’m curious as well—starting in the David Douglas District—what was your perception of Parkrose, if you had one? Either when you were in David Douglas or when you first moved to Parkrose—was there kind of something that defined it for you, or something that you thought was different from David Douglas when you were younger?
DVC: A lot of things, actually. In elementary school is when I started playing sports, and that district—the David Douglas District—had, I don’t know, a dozen elementary schools. I don’t even know. And I played every sport that they threw at us, and we played every other school. When I moved to Parkrose, there were sports for girls, but, for example, my first year at Heights Junior High, say, in softball—there was an A team and a B team, and Fremont Junior High had an A team and a B team. So we only played—we played our B team, their A team, their B team, and then do it over. And it really turned me off, it just was no fun. So that was sad.
PCA: Yeah, definitely. I’m kind of curious—maybe we can talk about this a little bit more when we get to talking about the high school experience—but what was sports like in Parkrose when you got here, and maybe when you were in high school, as well?
DVC: Yeah. I went out for—I remember track, and we were running up and down the halls. I mean, and it was the same kind of thing—I think basketball, I think we had like four schools on the schedule. And I was thinking about that today that made me wonder—I suspect the athletic director probably had nothing to do with girls sports, and it was just the coaches, probably, trying to piece together whatever they could. But I actually didn’t really participate in sports in high school, it just turned me off.
PCA: Yeah. So you arrived, when you came to Parkrose—
DVC: My ninth grade.
PCA: Okay. So you went into Parkrose High School when you first got here?
DVC: No, Parkrose Heights, the junior high. The junior highs, then, were 7, 8, 9, and the high school was 10, 11, 12.
PCA: Okay, okay. So you had one year there, and then the other three at the high school?
DVC: Three at the high school, yeah.
PCA: So, what was the experience like coming into the new school, and also, what the community at the school was like at that time, if you can speak to that?
DVC: Yeah. Well, one thing I remember—when you said like, comparing the two—I was a little bit anxious, because I knew where I was. And I remember when my parents told us that we were moving to Parkrose, all I remember thinking was, I have to say something positive, because they’ve been looking to do this for a decade. So I went, "Parkrose has a good school!" I had no clue—I mean, I knew of Parkrose, but I didn’t know. (Laughter)
PCA: (Laughter) Yeah, that’s fair.
DVC: But when I got here, you know, I did meet some neighborhood kids before school started. None of them really ended up being close friends later. But the transition wasn’t that hard—I made fast friends pretty quickly. And then one of the interesting things was, once you got to the high school, there were still Heights kids and Fremont kids, and kind of the blending took a year or so.
PCA: Yeah. That’s funny to think, because my parents also had the separate middle schools, and it’s so interesting to think about that dynamic going into the high school, because now it’s just like—everyone you know in middle school you know in the high school as well. I’m kind of curious too, if sports wasn’t a big aspect of your high school experience, were you involved in anything else? Or what were you interested in at the time?
DVC: Yeah, I did—I was involved in lots of things, and sometimes it would be random things, like—we had, each year, there was a canned food drive around the winter break, and it was a competition between the classes: sophomore, junior, senior. And my sophomore year, we won the canned food drive, and I and all my friends were out collecting cans and stuff. To our knowledge, we were the first sophomore class to ever do that. We also won our junior year and our senior year. So, we believe we’re the only ones to have won all three. And that actually became part of our—when we had our 50th reunion, we gathered donations and we contributed to the food banks in the community—
PCA: That’s great.
DVC: —in memory of, yeah.
PCA: Yeah, that’s cool! This is a little bit off track, but I’m kind of curious what the reunion was like, coming back after so many years. What was the dynamic, and what people were talking and reflecting on?
DVC: Well, our class—now, I didn’t really go to too many of the earlier ones, but our class has been getting together since the very beginning. We had a five year. I did go to that one. So, there wasn’t a huge gap. We get together—well I don’t go all the time—but there are get togethers every month.
PCA: That’s cool. So, just to confirm, you graduated in 1969?
DVC: Yeah.
PCA: Okay. So, in the high school, did you have any teachers or people that you kind of looked up to or had a big influence on you while you were there?
DVC: Um, not huge. Mr. Hancock was a history teacher, and he was a bit of a character. So I remember liking him. Mr.—oh, I just forgot his name. He was the athletic director for a while—
TC: Rotramel?
DVC: Rotramel! Yeah. Jim Rotramel. And he ran the attendance office, so I did work in there. But not anyone that made me think, oh, I want to be like them. Nothing like that. And then I was involved in clubs—like we had social clubs for each grad year. So, when you came in, you took the club of the group that just graduated, and ours was called Alpha-I-Daki. And so I participated in that, I was an officer in that. I was an officer in Girls League. I participated in French Club—stuff like that.
PCA: Nice. For those kinds of groups, what was the responsibilities of those sorts of roles?
DVC: The social club, it was kind of community service, and we always had some function that we were responsible for. Like a homecoming dance, or something like that. The Girls League, it was—the word that comes to mind is "political," in a way, because it’s trying to be a governmental structured thing to bring the girls together and advance the girls’ programs in whatever way we could. Obviously we were not successful with sports. (Laughter)
PCA: (Laughter) Yeah, yeah. I’m curious, because I’m sure you’ve been back to the high school since the new high school, since it’s been built. I’m kind of curious what that experience was like, and how the two schools differ, between the one you attended and my parents attended versus the one that’s there now.
DVC: It was circular, for one. So at lunch time, you just walked around. There were big ramps. There were not one, but two, smoking areas in the courtyard—
PCA: (Laughter) Nice.
DVC: —on campus! Something that comes up all the time in remembrances, too—the cooks made these huge cinnamon rolls. And we had a milkshake machine, too. So just—
TC: Wow.
DVC: —random stuff like that, yeah.
[DVC also noted via email: When I first saw the new school, it did not look as sturdy or substantial as the old one. I chalked it up to different, newer construction techniques. I’ve since come to see that the design in the classroom areas facilitates a variety of configurations. A very good thing! Overall, I do think it’s a beautiful building. The theater and new pool are fantastic and I like the design of the gym. I’m happy they left the stadium as is.]
PCA: That’s awesome. So, I’m kind of curious, too—what did you do after school, and what was that senior year like for you?
DVC: Well, after school, there was usually a club meeting. And during the week, I didn’t do a ton of socializing. My parents expected me to do my homework, but that was no big deal. I always did my homework. And we had certain family rules, like being home for dinner and stuff like that. So I didn’t do a lot during the week during the school year. And probably the big social things were the football games, basketball games—things like that, yeah.
PCA: Do you have a favorite memory from those years in school in Parkrose?
DVC: I always loved going to the state basketball tournament, that was fun.
PCA: Yeah. Where did they host that?
DVC: Memorial Coliseum.
PCA: Okay, cool, that’s awesome.
DVC: This is one of the—okay, this is the '60s—so there was always this, when the schools from like, Pendleton or Baker showed up, and they all had crewcuts, and nobody had crewcuts. (Laughter)
PCA: That’s awesome. After you graduated, what was your next step? What did you do after graduation?
DVC: I went to Portland State first, and then I transferred down to Oregon State.
PCA: Nice. Go Beavs.
DVC: That’s right. There’s a baseball game on right now. (Laughter)
PCA: What did you study in school?
DVC: I was just, very general studies. Actually, when I got down to Oregon State—and then I ran out of money and I didn’t finish—but they were just starting a degree program. I can’t remember exactly what it was called—but it was recreation, because the idea being that the next generations were going to have more leisure time, and so things for people do. And so I started on that, but like I said, I didn’t finish. I ran out of money.
PCA: Yeah. This is maybe a transition to turn to Tim, but I’m curious how you all met, and how you ended up in Parkrose, Tim?
TC: Oh. Well, we met when I was working. I was working a nightclub in the mid-eighties.
PCA: Oh, cool. Yeah.
DVC: Downtown.
TC: Downtown, yeah. And I grew up in northeast, inner-northeast. I went to Madeleine Grade School, Grant High School. I lived on 22nd [Avenue] and Alameda [Street] until 1974, and my dad remarried and we moved to Gresham, and I graduated—well, I didn’t graduate. I joined the Marines my senior year. And I first arrived in Parkrose in March—no, excuse me, not March—probably 86, the beginning of 1986. I was working for a firm that owned six neighborhood newspapers, and the [Mid-County] Memo was one of them. So I started working for them. I started at The Hollywood Star and moved out here to do this, but I still lived—because we bought a home on the same street I grew up in, northeast. So we moved here [to Argay Terrace] in 2003. We’ve been here since. So, yeah, I didn’t create the Memo, I just bought it from the owners. And the goals of the publication were the same—you know, the neighborhood, churches, schools, Rotary, Kiwanis—reporting on community.
DVC: Well, and you used to do those community awards things, every couple years.
TC: Right, yeah. Community awards.
PCA: I’m kind of curious, growing up in Alameda, what your perspective is on the changes that have happened in northeast Portland over the past few decades.
TC: You mean out here?
PCA: Both, I guess. Because I feel like that’s a very gentrified area now—
TC: Yeah.
PCA: —so I’m kind of curious on your thoughts, seeing the change over time.
TC: Well, our home—the home that we lived in for a long time recently sold for how much?
DVC: Like 800,000. We paid 72,000.
TC: In 1988, yeah. So as we touched on when you got here, this is a whole different area. Growing up in Portland—coming out here was kind of a shock, because of the set-backs of the homes, the pools out here in particular. Just the difference—the septic system. It was so radically different than where I grew up. It wasn’t literally a part of Portland, but it was, and it is now. And it still gets the step-child kind of treatment and attitude.
PCA: I’m curious, because when Parkrose was first founded and advertised, it’s kind of advertised as an area on the periphery of Portland—like suburb, agricultural area. But I feel like that—even after the annexation of Parkrose into Portland—kind of still resonates in that it feels a little bit like we’re on the periphery, and that we have kind of an interesting relationship to the center of Portland. I’m curious what you think of that, and if you kind of feel that same way?
TC: Oh, yeah. The only relationship we have with the center is that they try not to have much of a relationship with this area. They’ll take the tax money. But the services we got where we lived in Portland versus the ones out here—they’re just now getting to cleaning the streets regularly. We used to have leaf pickup every year. They just weren’t ready, I think, when they annexed this much land, to take it over, because the Portland Police—I mean, they had to establish new headquarters out here. No, it was not served well. The transition didn’t go—I’m sure, you know, historically it could’ve been better, could’ve been worse. But it wasn’t to a lot of people’s satisfaction out here. They still don’t like Portland, let alone paying the taxes, which are outrageous.
DVC: Well, and something that I thought of in seeing those questions on your pre-interview. Something that I began to feel many, many, years ago—I don’t think I necessarily had this sense when I lived here as a teenager that much—is that this is a really unique place, and could be so much more. There’s the mental and emotional desire, but there’s not the support. Because if we look at what we have, what we define as “Parkrose”—you know, a handful of neighborhoods—I kind of roughly use the school district.
PCA: Same, yeah.
DVC: And so we’ve got our own neighborhoods, our own school district, our own business district, which is almost dead. But if that, you know, if that could be viewed as a whole, instead of a part of Portland—
TC: —“East” Portland.
DVC: Yeah.
TC: That’s another issue, the marketing. They persisted in calling this “East.” When I grew up, okay, in my twenties, I’d go downtown—I worked downtown, worked at bars. People would say, “where did you grow up?” And I’d say, “oh, northeast Portland.” And they’d go, “ooo, sorry.” Because it was associated with—like, my dad, he didn’t like us to go north of Prescott, on 21st [Avenue]. Rough neighborhood. So growing up, if you’re from northeast Portland, people felt sorry for you. And now, it’s totally shifted. “Where’d you grow up?” “Oh, I grew up on 92nd [Avenue].” “Ooo, sorry about that.” “East Portland,” “ooo.” It’s got such a bad name, and it’s been aided by the city, it’s been aided by other media entities—anyway. It’s just a bad marketing deal for the whole area. And, Parkrose got lumped in with David Douglas, and now it’s this amorphous unit called “East Portland” that really has no identity, other than a shitty place to live. When you’re in jail downtown and they say, “where do you live?” “Oh, I live in the numbers.” The what?
PCA: Yeah.
TC: You’ve heard that term?
PCA: Yeah.
TC: Okay. That’s—
DVC: I had never heard it!
TC: —that’s how bad it’s gotten, is they know—in jail—“oh, I live in the numbers”—they know you live out here. So it’s Portland’s dumping ground in so many ways, literally and figuratively. It’s a dump out here. (Laughter)
PCA: Yeah. I mean I think that resonates with a lot of people from Parkrose, because I have conversations about that with parents as well. And then you have things like the K-Mart going down, and them putting the [Prologis warehouse] over there, and a lot of people are so against that, and they’re moving forward with it anyway. And it feels like those kinds of unwanted projects—
TC: Let me tell you a little story about that.
DVC: They don’t remember the whole story.
TC: The whole story was, I was on the neighborhood association at the time, and we fought—they wanted to develop that into a multi-family bunch of apartment buildings. The neighborhood association fought against that, and we settled on what we got, which is what we got. They forgot about that part. Now they’re against this, it’s like, who cares? We live next to Airport Way and the airport. That’s like all the kerfuffle about people driving up to Castlegate, like all the traffic—like we’re going to notice more traffic on Fremont because of Castlegate—you know where Castlegate is?
PCA: I think so, yeah.
TC: It’s the one you can only get through here. You can’t get to it from 148th [Avenue]—is it 148th?
DVC: Yeah.
TC: You can drive by it and see it, but they didn’t give it a driveway, which pissed off the neighbors. But the neighbors were saying, “oh the traffic, the traffic”—and it’s like, I’m going to notice another five cars a day on Fremont [Street].
PCA: That is very true. I think that’s another thing I kind of wanted to ask—especially of Darlene, because I feel like a lot of things kind of changed the landscape over the decades in terms of development in Parkrose. I think the freeways are a big one, and I’m kind of curious of—
TC: I remember going to the drive-in over by Jim Dandy’s before they put in 205, that’s how old I am, there was a drive-in there. You remember that, don’t you?
DVC: I knew it was down there, I don’t remember ever going to that drive-in, though.
TC: And the other thing—Parkrose had, like you were saying, such a thriving—it was its own little city, unincorporated city. And then here comes the Big Brother of Portland. 82nd [Avenue] is the dividing line, for sure.
DVC: Yeah. And I know you know this, but that’s why we have Maywood Park.
PCA: Yeah. I think that’s such an interesting example. It’s funny, because I’ll talk to my dad, who grew up off of Beech—like 105th [Avenue] and Beech [Street]. And him and his dad used to just walk to Rocky Butte, which is now impossible because the freeway is there. But it’s so interesting—
TC: Walk by the jail.
PCA: —yeah! I’m kind of curious what you all think about those big changes, and how maybe you felt the change over time, when those things kind of were incorporated into the neighborhoods and the community—like how that changed the community.
DVC: I don’t think I have as big an awareness, because by the time the actual physical freeway came in, if I recall, I was pretty much gone by then. But speaking of Rocky Butte—we used to climb up the back of Rocky Butte to get up to the Grotto, and we’d go through the Grotto. Because if you went through the front of the Grotto, you had to pay a quarter to go up the elevator, but you didn’t have to pay to go down. So we’d just climb up the back of the hill.
PCA: That’s awesome.
TC: That’s a new one. Never heard that one.
DVC: I did that with Christy Deich and Jan Carper. (Laughter)
PCA: From your perspective, Tim, what did you feel of the change over time? Did you notice it in the eighties, in particular?
TC: Well, people were so upset about the sewers. And the physical change—it of course, historically, I know it isolated—I didn’t grow up here—it isolated, cut this area—205 kind of cut the area off. The growth of the whole area, it necessitated all of this. The population is so increased. Portland is not a well-known secret anymore. People are—you know, hopefully, that sounds like it's changing, people don’t want to live in Portland anymore. But, it’s been radical with the millions of people that are coming here. It’s so—no, don’t get me started on that. I don’t want that recorded. People moving here. The Californication. Yeah, it’s terrible.
DVC: We grew up with Tom McCall, so. (Laughter)
PCA: (Laughter) Yeah.
TC: I don’t know if the change is for good. I think the jury might still be out. But I know the taxes keep going up. They keep trying to tax us more. You know, taxes are inevitable—but are they too high? I think they are. I’m sure your dad and your parents have talked about that.
DVC: Do they still live—
PCA: They still live in Parkrose Heights, yeah.
DVC: Yeah.
PCA: So we live off 102nd [Avenue] and Knott [Street].
DVC: Oh, okay.
PCA: So kind of Gateway area.
DVC: Near the Mormon church?
PCA: Yeah, pretty close to it, yeah. So my parents—my dad grew up off Beech [Street], my mom grew up by Russell Elementary. So she went to Russell. I went to Russell as well. And my brother and I both went to Parkrose. So it’s interesting to hear, because I think a lot of people share a common experience of what you’re talking about, especially if they’ve been here and kind of seen the change over time. I think that that’s a commonly shared—I grew up in the same house, and that’s the house my parents are still in, so it’s interesting to see the change. I think I notice it a little less, just because, you know, I was born and raised in Parkrose in the '90s and early 2000s, so it’s a little bit different, but—
TC: It’s more of what you got—it’s just more of the '90s. Since now here—I mean, the racial component out here was ridiculous. Like, where I grew up, we had one Black classmate in the elementary school I went to. Grant was different, a lot different. But Parkrose was still—now it’s 180 degrees different.
DVC: Well, and that’s an interesting one too, because that’s one of the big changes, and some of that comes from the gentrification of the inner-city, for sure.
PCA: I’m kind of curious—because we’ve kind of spoken about the annexation a little bit—but I’m curious, if you remember, how you both felt when that was going on, or kind of what people in Parkrose thought of that. Because, since I wasn’t alive at the time, I’m curious what people felt about that, whether they were against it, or for it, or more neutral. Was is kind of mixed?
TC: Well, the general impression I got—they were being forced to install sewers. Thousands of dollars. But the big question was, what are they getting in return? And they got nothing in return.
DVC: Yeah. I don’t—again, I wasn’t living here then, either—but I don’t remember anybody asking if that’s what we wanted—
TC: Yeah.
DVC: —it was just happening, and the biggest thing, I remember with my parents, was that sewer thing. They had to put in sewers. So ultimately, in the long run, it’s kind of nice to not have to deal with septic—but thousands of dollars. And this was middle-class neighborhoods, so.
TC: Yeah, the Mid-County Sewer Project.
PCA: Yeah. I’m curious, because I know you were on the neighborhood association—
TC: This one here, yeah.
PCA: What was that like? What was that experience like for you?
TC: Being on it, or covering it?
PCA: Let’s go being on it, and then we’ll turn in a little bit to the Memo.
TC: Oh, it was tedious.
PCA: Yeah.
TC: It was frustrating dealing with the city. It’s always, because the city is so—they have a repellent rectitude from the get-go. And there are very few—I’m not saying 100%—there aren’t enough people willing, bureaucrats willing, to understand and reach out and help people out here, in the greater sense. They have neighborhood associations, and once the government figures out who the people are going to volunteer and step up, then they just focus on those people, and look to them. I mean it’s so—it’s supposed to be grassroots, but there’s such little leadership from the city on any initiatives out here. I mean, they have grant programs and all that. In a lot of ways, I liken this—it’s not as bad as what the city did to the Emanuel neighborhood when they cut it up to build, or what neighborhood am I thinking of—
DVC: Albina?
TC: Yeah [Albina], where they built Emanuel Hospital. What the city did to that neighborhood. But with what the city’s done out here, it’s had the same practical effect. It’s alienated this area from the rest of the city. People out here, they don’t really feel a part of Portland. I mean, if they got more services, it might be, but they’re finally—I mean, as a homeowner, it’s great to see them out here with the sweepers, after they lay all the rocks, and then they sweep them up, which is good! You know.
DVC: (Laughter)
PCA: Yeah. Well, I’m kind of curious—turning to your experience with the Memo—I’m curious about how you got your start in journalism, and also kind of what the start with the Memo looked like for you.
TC: Well, I was sales, my partner was the journalism part. And I didn’t do any journalism until the last years, so I didn’t have any journalism training other than what I was exposed to and in and around it. I took photos, I took a lot of photos, but that was my main thing. And in the end, I started having to do stories. Hired a bunch of freelancers, but no journalism training, other than reading a lot of New York Times, Oregonian.
PCA: When you were working for the Memo, what did that kind of work-life look like for you throughout the years?
TC: It was the administrating and funding, selling the ads, and dealing with the clients. Very rarely did I deal—well, I had an editorial person. It was kind of bifurcated. I dealt with the ads and the sales and the administration, and he dealt with the neighborhoods and the cities and all the photo-doing. For years that was the way it was, for more than a decade. So I had very little editorial—I mean, yeah. I didn’t do any of it. One of your questions here is related to stories—I kind of parsed out stories to him, but he got his own stories, too. And a lot of it is self-generating—it’s just automatic. You know, you’re covering the schools, you’re covering the churches, you’re covering the Fun-O-Rama. You’re covering the sports. So that’s kind of set, what your beat is. And then every now and then you get good human interest and feature stories, and we did a lot of the—well, we did the Rose Festival, when it came, finally. It wasn’t here for a long time.
PCA: What is, from your perspective as someone who’s worked on it for decades, what do you think the importance of community journalism and community newspapers are?
TC: Oh, I think it’s real important. It’s real important. It connects people, which is the goal, I guess. It’s really important. It just became a losing proposition, you know, with the advent of the internet. That had a lot to do with it. And classified advertising, we were making headway that way and then that killed it. And just not being able to monetize the internet as quickly as other people have. It’s still a struggle for a lot of people. It was a free paper—we had a choice of going subscription, but at that point, just didn’t do it. It was free, and the advertisers would pay for it.
DVC: One thing that I came to learn was how important it was to certain groups of people, especially older people, really relied on the Memo.
TC: Because Darlene did a lot of the editorial—
DVC: Well, toward the end, yeah.
TC: —and what she’s talking about is the emails [she] used to get. We sent a monthly reminder to people like, “hey, this issue is coming out if you want to get noticed,” and then Darlene would get flooded with everybody—all the organizations would notify you, and let you know what’s coming up.
DVC: Yeah.
TC: So, it was a community resource for a lot of people.
PCA: Mmhm.
DVC: And one thing that I noticed, personally, when the Memo came to an end, is my connectivity to the community has waned. I mean, I’m not out and about as much, for sure, but people aren’t sending me things (laughter), and I’m not—I know the current school superintendent, but that’s only because I met him when he was a principal at Prescott. I mean, I knew Karen Gray pretty well—you know, we served on committees together and stuff like that. And I did know, briefly, Mike Taylor—[Tim] knew him better than I did.
PCA: Yeah.
DVC: Oh, speaking of superintendents, if you haven’t heard of this guy yet, you will—the superintendent of the district when I was in school was Dr. Victor Cullens. Have you heard that name?
PCA: (Laughter) Not yet, no.
DVC: (Laughter) You will! And the one thing everyone will tell you—we did not have snow days. The guy was from—what was it, North Dakota?
TC: Somewhere in the neighborhood.
DVC: Somewhere like that.
PCA: He didn’t believe in them? (Laughter)
DVC: Nope, nope, you’re coming to school. And in fact, our senior year, there was a big snow storm—
TC: Yep.
DVC: —and I’m presuming schools all around were closed. We were not. But midway through the day they sent us home. And some people were able to get on buses. I don’t really remember if I walked home that day, or if I was on a bus. But I do remember later, a few days later, walking—we lived on 108th and Fargo, so you kind of know where that is—to the Thriftway on 111th and Halsey. Was it both my sisters? Anyway, we went up to get some groceries, because my dad worked for Northwest Natural Gas, and he’d been gone for days. So we walked up to the store and got whatever Mom said we needed.
TC: Terrible three, four day snowstorm.
DVC: Yeah, it was deep. (Laughter)
TC: I’ll never forget that. ‘69!
PCA: I’m kind of curious, too, because I know you mentioned Karen Gray and working on committees with her. What else were you involved in in Parkrose? Were you involved in anything else other than the Memo?
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DVC: I served on the Parkrose Educational Foundation board for six or seven years, yeah. And I was president, briefly, but mostly because the president left for personal reasons, so I was like, okay.
PCA: Need someone to do it?
DVC: Yeah, yeah.
PCA: What was that experience like?
DVC: I actually loved it. I wasn’t as involved directly with the auction as some other people. I did, toward the end, get into trying to gather donations, but there were other people that did all that work. I mean, that was a ton of work. So the money that was raised was then gifted as, we called them grants, to pretty much any teacher, or—did students ever? Anyway, if there was something that wasn’t being funded by the district—
TC: Field trips.
DVC: —they could come to us. And I loved giving that money away. I loved it.
PCA: That’s cool.
DVC: Yeah. It was fun.
PCA: Nice. Well, I’m kind of curious—this is turning back to the Memo a little bit, and maybe you could both touch on this since you both did work with it. But what were some of the biggest challenges in running the paper over the years?
DVC: Deadlines for me. (Laughter)
PCA: (Laughter) I feel that.
TC: Just maintaining a client base that could support the paper, and support a living. That was the challenge, is working with the business community out here. You know, the associations and the individual business owners. Just to try to sell them the vision. Many of them saw it, many of them didn’t. They couldn’t understand the difference between what the Memo was doing and what the coupon rag was doing or whatever. There was no content. Advertising was the same—I mean, the goal was the same, but the difference is the content. I mean, if you just have a flier with just coupons, okay, boom gone. If you have something with your kid’s picture in it, you’re going to keep it around your house, and then the ads are going to be looked at. And the translation—my job was to try and sell that vision, that your consumer, your business consumer, is going to endear themselves to you if you’re supporting the organ that’s supporting the schools. So that was the challenge. Some businesspeople got it, some didn’t, you know. That’s just the way it was. The way it always is.
DVC: Yeah. Well, and that reminds me, too—I can’t tell you how many times after a story, and one I remember in particular—I don’t know if I found it accidentally or if a parent reached out. But some little girl had won a free throw shooting contest, and she went to—what’s the school on 92nd [Avenue]? It’s a Portland Public School—
TC: [Jason] Lee?
DVC: Yeah, yeah. So her parents reached out, because we put her picture in [the Memo], and they reached out. They wanted copies of the paper and they wanted some at the school. I remember taking them to the school. I don’t know how many times I took a stack of papers to somebody’s house because their kid or their mom or—yeah.
PCA: Well, that’s totally what I feel was the value of it, because I always enjoyed reading it, because I saw people I knew in it all the time. And I think that’s the kind of thing that you can’t get from a bigger paper—you just don’t get that kind of coverage, and it’s really cool to have that in a community.
DVC: Actually, that was something I was pretty proud of, was that round-up that I did each quarter. And I tried—I spent hours on that. (Laughter) I tried to dig out every little—and it could be honor roll, it could be, you know, the sports, it could be—
TC: Science fair.
DVC: —yeah! Anything. I dug out everything I could, just to try, because I wanted every kid in the circulation to see their name in the paper.
PCA: Totally, yeah. I did a few times, and every time I loved it. (Laughter) It was great.
TC: Kids will never see that now.
DVC: Yeah, yeah.
TC: You know, the internet’s like a big whale, swallowed everything.
PCA: Yeah. I’m curious, that kind of goes off the same subject, but I’m curious what your favorite stories were to do, or what your favorite piece of putting the paper together was.
DVC: One of the very first stories that Tim asked me to do—I think it was someone who reached out because her mom was about to celebrate her 100th birthday. So I met with her and the mom at an adult foster care, where the mom was living. And I remember talking to them, and the lady didn’t really hear very well—although I think she heard better than her daughter thought, because her daughter would like scream everything into her ear (laughter), and then help her answer. But it was at that moment that I realized—and it’s trite now—but everybody has a story. Everybody. And that lady had been a beautician for sixty years or something—maybe not that long—but yeah. Everybody has a story. I remember a young woman, she lived up on 122nd [Avenue], who went to the NASA Space Camp, because she wanted to be an astronaut. I interviewed her and her family was all sitting around while I was interviewing her. And then I later reached out to her on another project I tried to do that I was unsuccessful at. I was creating, for the alumni website, a newsletter. So I would reach out to people and at that point, I didn’t have any way of saying—it was like the first two or three issues—so I didn’t have a good way of saying, you know, if you’re an alumni, send me your story, type thing. So I reached out to people I knew from different classes, so I reached out to her—a ‘where are they now?’ kind of thing. And she and her—were they married yet?—anyway, were down at George Fox [University], and she was studying something related. She goes, “I probably won’t go up in space, but I’m still doing it,” and yeah. So those—just sitting down with people in their living rooms. Like this!
PCA: Totally. That’s the inspiration for my project as well, yeah! (Laughter) Tim, do you have any favorite stories or memories?
TC: It’s hard to say. I guess the favorite time was probably around the Fun-O-Rama time, when they did the parade and the carnival, because I was involved in that. And that was community activity at its finest, so-to-speak. That was probably my favorite topic to cover. High school sports and taking pictures of the sports was fun, because I did that in high school. Um—
DVC: Fun-O-Rama was a big deal when I was growing up.
PCA: Yeah.
TC: Yeah, favorite topics? I guess all of them. I mean, it’s really hard, because they were all worthy of coverage. I think what Darlene alluded to was the individual stories were always fulfilling and worthwhile, because the amount of satisfaction that it gave to those people and their families was gratifying. Because it was a singular look that they might not—I mean, we did other stories on people that were famous, and they would get other publication. But as Darlene said, it’s the people that you know are never going to get their name in the Oregonian, or their name on television. They seemed to appreciate and understand it more than just somebody that was on their way up, and you were just in the way—politicians would say, oh my god, I’ve got to talk to you again?
DVC: Well, I guess I went in with an expectation, like I knew I was going to go talk to a hundred-year old lady.
PCA: Right.
DVC: But you always learn more than you expect to, I think.
TC: Mmhm. The education you get from doing that—like I’m sure you’re getting. (Laughter) You want some coffee?
PCA: Sure, that would be great.
TC: How do you like it?
PCA: Just black is fine. Thank you. I can ask you this in the meantime, what were those Fun-O-Ramas like?
DVC: Well, I remember those, even from as a little child. I actually remember—and I think it was probably because my mom wasn’t driving yet, so I was like, eight years old or something. So we lived on 127th [Avenue] and Stark [Street]. The parade was up on Halsey [Street]. We walked up to watch the parade, and the carnival itself was a big deal, a really big deal.
TC: Yeah, it was a similar time to Rose Festival, but it was for this area.
PCA: Oh cool, yeah.
TC: You didn’t have to go downtown.
DVC: The carnival was up at Gateway—
TC: Fred Meyer’s.
DVC: —behind, yeah, where the back [Gateway] Fred Meyer parking lot is. It was there. It was just a big field, you know. And the family who ran the carnival lived in Parkrose. My sister went to school with—what was her name, Blaire? Something like that. So, you know, the ferris wheel goes up, and the Tilt-A-Whirl comes in. Yeah, it was fun.
PCA: That’s cool.
DVC: And in high school we would walk up there and meet up with people, you know, it was a very social thing. It was a lot of fun.
PCA: I’m curious, because obviously that area behind [Gateway] Fred Meyer is now a MAX station, and so do you remember the MAX stations being put in, or is there any memory of that?
DVC: No, that was newer, too, in that regard. Yeah. But I remember—well, Tim, I’m sure, did a story on that when the Gateway Arch came down, because that was another place you’d just kind of go and hang out. Because there were lots of different little stores and shops, and you’d meet people up there. I used to walk everywhere in high school, too.
PCA: Did you have a favorite store, or restaurant, that you enjoyed going to?
DVC: Tim can help me with this—I kind of forget the names of them. There was one that was one up at Gateway. It had this big thing, it was called like “the Satellite Room,” or something. My family didn’t go out to dinner very much, and when we did we went out to Tad’s in Troutdale or someplace. (Laughter) Hey Tim?
TC: Yeah?
DVC: What was that restaurant up at Gateway and 102nd [Avenue]? Was it like “the Satellite?” Or—
TC: Starlight.
DVC: Starlight?
TC: Yeah. The one in Gateway? Starlight Cafe.
DVC: Yeah. And there were all the fast food joints, you know we would sometimes—Oh! Friday nights we would go to Shakey's, which was a pizza parlor up where the Winco is now, on 122nd [Avenue]. In fact, it’s probably about where the Subway sandwich shop is. It’s right in there. Shakey's Pizza. That was a hangout, too.
TC: Yeah, another thing about the Fun-O-Rama is they lost their site at the carnival. It was a huge money maker for years for the business association, and they lost it just the year or so before I came out here, like in ‘84 or ‘85. They struggled, for a long time, because they didn’t have a carnival, so we were always trying to get the carnival back. We got it back for a year or so, it just didn’t work out, at the old North’s Chuckwagon.
DVC: Oh, that’s right, I forgot about that, yeah.
TC: Yeah. It came back for a while, but that really—it was another wound to the area, was losing that site as a money maker. Because it funded the Keystone Cops—you remember them?
PCA: No, I don’t think so.
TC: Yeah. Have you reached out to the Rossis?
PCA: I haven’t yet, but I’m hoping to, yeah.
TC: So the Keystone Cops—they were the “Gateway Keystone Cops,” and they were a bunch of business guys that took this money that they made and bought this van. They dressed up like Keystone Cops and went to different parades all around the Northwest, it was a big deal.
DVC: Yeah, so—there was representation, you know? They might go by somebody in another town and they didn’t know who it was, but eventually they did, you know?
PCA: Yeah.
TC: Yeah, they would do that for years—for years they did that. They had little skits, yeah. It was quite the community—
DVC: Yeah, and that’s the key thing. There’s no substitute for a community event like that. A parade, a carnival, what could be better? Maybe a barn dance. (Laughter)
TC: Yeah. We had a barn dance for a while. But the Fun-O-Rama days was a big deal, because it reached out here, and David Douglas. And it was separate—I never even knew anything about that growing up. I knew totally about the Rose Festival—we’d go to the fun center all the time—but I never even knew that this whole other world out here existed.
PCA: Yeah. We kind of just touched on it, but thinking about Gateway, and kind of what Gateway was, what it’s been planned to be, and what it is—what is the changes that you’ve seen to it throughout the years?
TC: Well because of the homeless, because of the indigent, because of the poverty-stricken nature of this area that people were shunted out here—what happens now is all the major service providers, or their headquarters, are out here, because this is where the indigent, poverty, homeless population is. So it’s a huge shift in industrial—instead of having car dealers and dry cleaners, we got state headquarters and—wow. I was just thinking about the one on Glisan, the one across from Menlo Park? It’s now a huge state headquarters. Anyway, that’s been the big shift, I’ve noticed, is that the poverty that has moved out here has become codified and industrialized and gentrified. There’s so much money—there’s more money in poverty than there is in running a business. So that’s been sad to see, that transition, that East Portland became the low-income place for Portland. As where I grew up gentrified, everything shifted out here. Even the bad areas where I grew up became gentrified. Like, “Mississippi?” “You were down on Alberta [Street]? Oh my god!” You know, that was in the ‘70s. And now, it’s the opposite. It’s like, “you’re out there in the numbers?” It’s just so, so different. That bad reputation has come this way. Deserved or not, you know, there’s some definitely heavy career criminals out here. But it’s—and again, I don’t know. Maybe this happens in other cities, where the core becomes gentrified, and you can’t afford it, and then all the problems move out—out of the inner core, where all the nice things are. All the cultural things downtown. You know, who can afford to live in the Pearl District? You’ve got to have some money to live in the Pearl District. Not a long time ago.
PCA: Yeah. Well, that’s one thing I’m curious about—is to see how that continues to progress, because it’s like—will it just keep being pushed further east, and then will Parkrose become gentrified in a few years?
TC: It’s happening! Roseway, all that area down there—it’s moving this way. And that area used to be—Alameda was one of the best neighborhoods, and now, it’s still really good. But now Roseway, and Rose City, they’re becoming really hot neighborhoods. And it is moving further east, because more people are moving here. As far as I know, Portland is still going up in population. Maybe it’ll slow, but.
PCA: In terms of someone who’s been here and seen some of the challenges and issues—not necessarily saying you have to come up with a solution for everything—but what do you think would help in Parkrose?
TC: Um—oof.
DVC: Well, I’m hopeful that this new form of city government with direct representation will help. I don’t know. I’m hopeful.
TC: It’s—yeah. I’m not too hopeful about the repellent rectitude that city bureaucrats display towards this area is going to change any time soon. I could see it only getting worse as they talk about budget defaults and all that. But as somebody who pays a lot of taxes—they could spend a lot less on administration and a lot more on community, in my opinion. Because they don’t seem to lack for money when they want to do things. That’s been my experience is like, they talk about not having money, but when they really want to do something, they find the money to do it.
PCA: Yeah. I think, in terms of thinking about—kind of a failure of the City of Portland, I think just because I’m close to Gateway—like Gateway is such a clear example to me of a place where they say they’re going to put money in and it just does never really happen. They’ll have a big plan for it, and it just falls through. And hopefully someday, they’ll be willing to put some money into it and have some sort of resource here for Parkrose, but I do feel like it’s oftentimes neglected.
TC: I think the money they put in is ill spent.
PCA: Totally.
TC: They spent all that money on that little park, right where Halsey [Street] and Weidler [Street] meet, and it’s become a nicer place for the homeless. And—
DVC: Well, that’s like the jughandle.
TC: —yeah.
PCA: Where they had the red poles there for a while? Yeah. (Laughter)
DVC: (Laughter) Yeah, yeah.
TC: Windscape! Oh, that was one of my favorite stories ever I guess. Windscape.
PCA: Oh yeah, I’d like to hear about that.
TC: Windscape?
PCA: Yeah.
TC: The jughandle?
PCA: Yeah.
TC: There’s some money. When they were redesigning 102nd Avenue, they redesigned that jughandle. And they put—it’s all in the Memo. So, they built a—
DVC: Read the story. (Laughter)
TC: —yeah. You can look it up. They built a cement thing to make it nicer, and then they put in the poles—the windscape. Those poles were supposed to vibrate in the wind and make noise, and that was such a bad—there’s an example of a vanity project. Because again, I can’t remember the particulars, but somebody from the city got paid a lot of money to design that thing, and the cement they used on it was the rock I think they dug up on 102nd [Avenue]. It was part of that. But anyway, it was all these great intentions, and we’re going to use this, and this was the detritus of this project, and we’re going to make it the walls, and they spent all this money on this design—and as far as the community went, it was just the biggest dud, because they had no idea what it was, couldn’t care less, and it just became a haven for the homeless.
PCA: Yeah.
TC: They spent all that money on these interpretative plaques. And there’s an example of a boondoggle, the city just narcissistically—I don’t want to use any bad words—but doing something to itself that makes itself feel really good.
PCA: Yeah.
TC: It made all the bureaucrats feel really good. “The windscape—oh, look at us!” That happens a lot—“oh, look at us! Look at what we did.” (Laughter) “Cut that ribbon!”
PCA: (Laughter) That’s like, a perfect example, though, because I remember when those went up, and I remember looking at them and I’d be like, are they going to put flags on them or something? Like, what’s happening with them.
DVC: (Laughter) Yeah!
PCA: And then they just decided to take them out, at a certain point. They’re just gone now.
TC: Yep. Because the homeless people started—(Laughter)
DVC: Started recycling them!
TC: —yeah, cutting them down and recycling them. It was more valuable to them than it was to us. There’s a perfect example. You should look it up. We covered it extensively. And the letters we got—the letters we got.
DVC: Oh, letters to the editor were always fun.
TC: (Laughter) Yeah.
DVC: They were always fun. Boy.
PCA: Man. So, what has been the decision for you all to stay in Parkrose? So you bought this house in 2003?
DVC: Mmhm.
PCA: Did you know you wanted to be here when you bought it, that you were just going to stay here? Or kind of what was that—
TC: We moved out here because of my work.
PCA: Yeah.
TC: It was more convenient for me, because where we lived before, it was very close to Darlene’s work.
DVC: Well, and also, he worked at Hollywood for the first year and a half or whatever. So we thought he was going to be Hollywood, and I was close in Southeast, and yeah.
TC: So we bought the paper and working out here was convenient. Everything was around here instead of driving out here everyday. So yeah, we thought we would be—we’re still here. We like it. We like the neighborhood, and it’s convenient to us. We have property in Klickitat, so it’s even more of an easier jump out that way.
PCA: Yeah. I’m kind of curious, too, because I feel like one of the things that is unique about Parkrose is, like, the Rossis, and the farmland area.
TC: Mmhm.
PCA: So I’m kind of curious what you all think of that, especially coming from more of an urbanized area of Portland.
TC: It’s very unique. I mean, it’s one of the features of this area was the Giustos and the Rossis and the Spadas and the farming culture. Like you said, those ads—“hey, great farming culture.” No, it was totally unique. It was part of the whole charm of the area coming out here, and acclimating myself to all the differences between this part of Portland and the place I grew up. And it was different, of a degree, and there were some nuances. A lot of similarities, but there were definite nuances and cultural differences. And there was a more insular feeling out here than there was—I was more part of the Portland Interscholastic League, which is Wilson, Jefferson. And Parkrose is Parkrose. Which, the insular feeling which it gives people out here is—it’s more conducive to get things done, because people are closer together. They’re closer knit than a bigger area. So there is a lot of potential out here, I guess, still. But I’ve never seen it really—it may be true that Parkrose has seen its best days ever, you know. Even before I got here.
PCA: Yeah, I’m curious about that too. Maybe Darlene can speak to this a little bit, but that feeling of community. Because I do think that’s unique, being in an area that is considered Portland. Like, I do think there is a pretty strong sense of community, and I think it could be from that—just that we’re so separate from the rest of Portland and Portland School Districts, but—
TC: And had for years, due to their own business district, cultural events, and it was just their own thing. And now it’s been infiltrated and diluted a lot by Portland, and they’ve lost a lot of the events that made it unique.
PCA: Yeah. Do you feel that way as well?
DVC: Yeah, very much so, yeah. There’s no singular identity. Like—you know, as far as the farm fields, that part to me was totally normal. And I do recall in high school—the new building is on part of that, now—but it’s kind of like the parking area and that walking trail. That was still Rossi farmland. They hadn’t donated that to the school district yet. And they grew cabbage there. So every fall—have you ever been around a cabbage field in the fall?
PCA: (Laughter) No.
DVC: It smells like cabbage!
PCA: (Laughter) I was gonna say, yeah.
DVC: And everybody that came to our school, like during the football season, for example. Oh man, we got so much grief for that. You know, kids from Hillsboro would come out and complain about Parkrose!
PCA: Like, “it smells like cabbage out here.”
DVC: Yeah, yeah.
PCA: That’s funny. What was Rossi—like, when I was a kid, Rossi’s, you could go there and buy produce and stuff. And obviously now, they do the events and things. But I’m curious what they were like as kind of like, a namesake, while you were in high school.
DVC: Now, I wasn’t as aware of them—a lot of my male classmates were, because Aldo [Rossi] was involved in sports. It was called the Dad’s Club. And he didn’t have any children in the high school when I was there. But he was involved—I guess it’s probably the Boosters now, but it used to be called the Dad’s Club. And I guess he was sometimes running the chains on the sidelines—I’m sure he was involved in other sports as well. So my awareness was just, they were farmers. I didn’t know them. But one thing that I learned with some projects that Tim worked on, the farmers out here—lots of Italians, and so many of those families I went to school with, but I didn’t realize that was what they did. I was not aware of that at that time. So, that was fun to learn and it really connects that history.
PCA: Definitely, yeah. In terms of thinking about Parkrose, and maybe how people outside of Parkrose see Parkrose—what do you wish people knew more about? Or maybe if there’s a misconception that some people might have, what would you correct?
DVC: That’s a hard one, because first of all, they either don’t know—like you said—or like Tim has suggested, it’s like, “oh, sorry.” So I guess—okay, this becomes a challenge. Because I want them to come out here and see, but then what would I direct them to? Because downtown Parkrose is not pleasant. So it’s kind of hard. So then you just direct them to, oh, the Rossi barn, that’s close. The Barn, on 148th [Avenue], oh, that’s close. There’s a brew pub there, we need one of those. The pumpkin patch is gone. So it’s hard. I always—Tim will vouch for this—I always get a little wrapped up in my pride of things, so it really hurts me when people don’t know.
PCA: I feel the same way, you know—I think especially coming from here and going to a state school and people don’t know about it, or they have the same opinion where they’re like, “oof, Parkrose,” you know? And I think that’s true though. I think it’s hard—I wish there was more of a—even like, better restaurants, maybe? Like restaurants that people could really go to. Our food scene is not—
DVC: Yeah.
PCA: —the best.
DVC: (Sarcastically) What do you mean? We’ve got Carl's Jr. (Laughter)
TC: Cascade Station.
PCA: Oh, that’s something else we can talk about, too, because that’s—I mean, that was wild when that was built, to me, because it’s so new, and every time I go there it seems like they’ve built something else, too.
TC: It wasn’t even supposed to be what it is.
PCA: Yeah.
TC: It was never supposed to be what it is. They had a rule against big boxes. They were not going to allow any big box at all. And then, 9/11, and that destroyed the real estate market. So they go, oh, well maybe we will. Next thing you know, IKEA, and Best Buy—
DVC: Home Depot. I mean, they’re not in Cascade Station, but they’re close.
TC: There were at one time, I think so.
PCA: They’re off Airport Way at least, so it’s right close by.
DVC: Yeah.
PCA: So you kind of remember when that was being built, then?
TC: Oh, yeah, definitely. It was a moratorium on—they wanted to have a small business thing. Nope. And it is what it is now, it’s total corporate. I don’t know if you’ve been to the East Coast—corporate. Corporate, corporate, corporate, corporate, corporate, corporate, everywhere. I mean, I’m sure there’s small pockets of family-owned businesses. But everything on the East Coast eventually ends up here, and it’s coming here. Just like everything in Israel ends up here. Terrorism ends up here, everything. And now this. Sorry, that was kind of a non sequitur.
DVC: (Laughter) Ya think?
TC: But everything in New York—I was in New York, for a while, and it was funny, because fashion and things would happen in New York, and then 90 days later, it’s like, oh, here it’s in Portland. Now, it’s taken years, but the East Coast is coming here. The character of this area is changing, and I can’t say it’s for the good, or better. Everybody feels like they’re in a holding pattern to see what happens.
DVC: Well, as to your question, when we bought here, did we plan to stay here forever? I don’t know that we talked about it ever—
TC: No.
DVC: —specifically like that. And in fact, we may have kind of felt like we would move permanently up to Klickitat at some point.
TC: And that changed, and we’ve been here since.
DVC: Yeah.
PCA: I think that’s a similar story to my parents, and I’m sure a lot other people that are from here, because it’s like—I don’t think my parents necessarily thought that my brother and I would stay in Parkrose and go to the same high school and school district, but it just worked out that way. And I think, you know, they like where they live. They have the same kind of gripes with the issues of the community, as I’m sure many do. But I think that they—I think a lot of people in Parkrose are still able to recognize the unique features of it. There’s a lot valuable about it. And I think learning the history about it is interesting, because you can kind of see the trend and the changes over time. And I do think the gentrification of other parts of Portland are a big part of that, and the annexation of the community into the city [of Portland]. But I’m kind of curious—on a more positive note—what your favorite part of the community is, being here or over time, I suppose?
DVC: Well, I guess I’m comfortable out here since I started my life out here. That’s probably a big part of it for me. And then our specific neighborhood, I love Luuwit View Park.
PCA: Yeah. That’s beautiful.
DVC: I go every morning. I walk there every morning. So those would be a couple things. I love—of course, I’ve always liked this, and it probably wouldn’t matter where I lived—I kind of have always loved Marine Drive. I mean, I would just go drive it, just because I could. Now this, not so much—partly because I don’t have my kayak anymore—but the [Columbia] slough, paddling on the slough. But it’s a little scary now. So that—
TC: Pirates down there.
DVC: —yeah. And we used to walk our dog down there. But yeah. I see great blue herons fly over every once in a while, and that’s because the slough is right there. Yeah, I’m comfortable here.
TC: I don’t think I would want to move back to where we were, because it is so—there is a little bit more breathing area out here. And you’re still not too far out, either, a hundred blocks.
DVC: Yeah. Here’s one thing that I noticed after we lived here for a short time. The street we lived on in Alameda was very social. I mean, we had progressive dinners and Fourth of July parades and parties with just our street. And you’d kind of, in the winter time, everybody would disappear inside, and then first sign of spring, people are out in their yards, and then all of a sudden, there’s six of you out in the street talking. And then we moved here, and it’s like everybody comes home, drives into their garage, closes their garage door, and you don’t see anybody.
PCA: Yeah.
TC: Yeah, it’s changed quite a bit. Just the setbacks on the hom. It just changes interaction with the neighbors. Because you’re familiar with inner-Portland—
PCA: Mmhm.
TC: —how different it is.
DVC: The lots are bigger out here, too.
PCA: Yeah. Definitely.
TC: And it just is conducive more for less—that’s why Parrkose was unique, because it had its own community—
DVC: And I want that back! (Laughter) I want that back.
TC: —yeah. But your kids all went to the same school. And, there just aren’t as many kids out here anymore. I mean, when we moved out here, there weren’t a lot. Even the kids that were here are now grown, and they’re not running around the streets anymore. Occasionally we see some, but not a lot. So this area is also, just generally, older. That’s what the demographics for the paper used to show. I used to always tell people that yes, the difference between this part of Portland and other parts of Portland was when the kids grew up in the inner-part of Portland, they left and moved and the parents moved. Out here, parents stayed. Kids moved out, parents stayed.
PCA: Totally.
DVC: And I can’t tell you how many of my classmates now live in their parents’ home.
PCA: Yeah. I think that’s where the generational kind of thing—like, the fact that my dad stayed here, his dad went to Parkrose—
TC: Wow. It’s deep.
PCA: —yeah, yeah. It’s funny, but I feel like that’s a common experience. Like when I talk to my best friends from high school, their parents also went to Parkrose, you know? Which I think is rare, in a city community.
TC: It is, it is. And that’s what’s lasted.
DVC: I was telling Tim the other day, one of my classmates—in fact, when we first moved here, she lived right up the street on Fremont [Street]. I’m not really sure where she is now. But her parents went to Parkrose. Obviously she did. Her children went to Parkrose. And she was going to athletic events of her grandkids when we moved here, so. And there’s a fair number of those.
PCA: Definitely, yeah.
DVC: Some people I didn’t know about, but there are maybe as many as a dozen couples from my class who got married right out of high school, and are still married. A couple of them have lost one of the spouses, but they were married for their whole [life], yeah.
PCA: Yeah. My parents met in eighth grade.
TC: (Laughter) That’s great.
PCA: Yeah. They met at the middle school.
TC: That’s great.
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PCA: Well, I think that’s pretty much all my questions, unless there’s anything else you want to add that we didn’t touch on.
DVC: I was trying to think—something came into my brain a minute ago, but now I don’t remember what it was—yeah. I wish I could come up with something a little more specific to make a place to recommend, but we’re in such a place right now. Yeah.
PCA: No, I think that’s true. I think my parents feel that as well.
TC: Yeah. I wish that the powers that be down at Parkrose Business District would get their act together. They put that PDC program together, that Historic Parkrose—(sarcastically) that’s done a lot. It’s gone down since then. I mean, there’s so many eyesores down there. If they applied some pressure like they do in other parts of the city to make things better then it would get done, but they don’t. That’s sad. I wish that would change, because a revitalized district would change the whole neighborhood.
DVC: Yeah. I wish Historic Parkrose had some teeth and some willpower, yeah.
PCA: Yeah, yeah. I remember I went to like a—this is not Historic Parkrose—but a Parkrose Business Association meeting in high school. Like I got invited to go for a lunch or whatever. And they—
TC: Yeah.
DVC: Were you getting a scholarship?
PCA: (Laughter) I did later, but that wasn’t why I was there for the lunch. I was there because I was in business and Future Business Leaders of America, and I got invited to go with my [project] partner at the time. And they had a presentation at the time of what they were going to do to Sandy [Boulevard]. Basically, they were going to redo all the storefronts. They had like renderings of what everything was going to look like. I drive down Sandy [now], and it looks exactly the same as it did ten years ago, when they said they were going to do that. So, Sandy reminds me of Gateway as well, in that I feel like there’s lots of plans for it, but it just never—it’s never executed.
DVC: Yeah.
TC: People get paid to make those plans.
PCA: Yeah.
DVC: And then it stops, stops right there!
TC: And then, “oh, that plan, it’s outdated, we’ve got to come up with another plan.” And they never do.
PCA: Yeah.
TC: But these [Mid-County Memo] morgue books, I want you to take them with you, and then, you know, there should be some stuff in there that helps.
PCA: Yeah, that would be awesome.
TC: I hope.
PCA: Absolutely! Thank you so much.
DVC: Yeah, thank you.
PCA: It’s been great. It’s been great chatting with you.